10 replies to this topic

[bornfreedom]

I am seeking help with The Christian in Complete Armour.

I've finally found a copy of The Christian in Complete Armour from the public domain that is not riddled with words that failed to scan properly. It does have many footnotes that are in Latin but little by little using Word's spell check tool I have been getting rid of them.

I have also been Abridging this precious gem. I realize that not everyone has the patience to read a 1000 page book written in Olde English, and in a style that resembles the KJV of the Bible. I have been using a combination of Dictionaries and Thesaurus's to find words that would accurately replace the Archaic words in this book, as well as to help me rephrase certain sentences that simply do not flow properly with modern English. In many cases their needs to be no abridgement and making changes would take from the beauty of the style in which brother Gurnall wrote. I am no expert at this, but I have found that after nearly completing one chapter with the help of many online dictionaries I've been able to make the necessary modifications without changing any of the original meaning at all. I've also found that the necessary modifications are not many. There are many instances of the same type of modifications to be made but not many different types of modifications. Does that make any sense?


I have separated the book into 19 Word documents, one for each chapter. I'm almost done with chapter one, that is I have moderately abridged it, I replaced all archaic words and expressions with more modern. I did not dumb it down, that is to say that I did not find the simplest words possible, the book is well written and so I did not want to change that. I used what I felt in my judgment were words that fit the purpose and intent of the author, in some cases it was simply changing thou to you or heareth to hear. But in other cases it was more complex like changing Treatise to Exposition or Magazine to Storehouse. My overall goal is to make it readable without changing the style or the message. If any of you are familiar with the Easy Read King James Version compared to the KJV that is a very good comparison of what I am hoping to do.

If anyone is interested in helping please reply and specify how many chapters you'd like to work on. If you choose to work on only one it will be greatly appreciated. I will send you a copy of Chapter 1 unabridged as well as a copy of my abridged version, in this way you can compare the two and get a general Idea of what it is that I am aiming for. All I ask is that whoever decides to help if any, that you give your best effort, and use good dictionaries and thesauruses. Also keep in mind that the idea is to make the work readable while at the same time preserving the style in which it was written as well as keeping the original message of every changed statement or word accurate and unchanged.

I know it's a lot that I am asking.. but I think this book is well worth it. And to think of everyone who will be blessed by it just gets me all giddy..lol

[APsit190]

It does have many footnotes that are in Latin but little by little using Word's spell check tool I have been getting rid of them.

Whatever you do, do not get rid of the Latin in the footnotes. Believe it or not, but the Latin is important to the understanding of the Author's thought process even though most do not understand Latin. Also, its important to note that the author used Latin as part of his exegesis (the method of interpreting Scripture), and so its integral to the text of the book. Moreover, the Author used Latin for emphasis in the text, and by removing the Latin, you remove the emphasis of what he said. So, please - leave - the Latin in.

Blessings,

Edited by APsit190, 08 May 2012 - 02:30 AM.

[Ed Franklin]

Technically, that is not "Old English"....it's barely "Middle English" and the style of the Jacobean/Caroline era is really the beginning of "Modern English" (as is the King James text)

Banner of Truth did an abridgment in "modern English" a few years ago. Personally, I'm skeptical of both abridgements and language "improvements" In the Bible world, that's the justification for 900 variations of the English version though, in fact, it's just a money pit for publishers.

Gurnall's work is readable and understandable to any educated English reader who will put forth the slightest effort. I'm afraid to look, but I guess there are "modern English" versions of Shakespeare out there too! good grief!

[DoctorDaveT]

To Bornfreedom,

I've been building digital modules for three years now. Most have been very simple; but I've done a handful that have taken quite a bit of time. I've asked for help on a couple projects, and for the most part, those kinds of requests fall on deaf ears.

I've served in the pastorate for over 10 years. I've found this to be true: people come to me and say, "Pastor I think we need to...", and it's usually a hint to add more ministry to my plate. My initial response to that type of a statement is always something like this: "No one is going to have the passion to do this like you; and since this is on your heart, perhaps God is calling you to do it."

If you feel this project is worthy to be done, I highly encourage you to do it. If you get some help, great. If not, forge ahead. If you get advice that goes against what you think best, consider it for sure, but don't feel the need to follow it. Follow The Spirit of God and feel free to ignore everything I (and everyone else) will tell you.

If you don't get help with the editing process, you may fare a little better by asking for proofreading help as the project nears completion. I have had some success with getting a few "critical" eyes to proofread my work. Proofing is an important part of module building, yet I think very few builders submit their work to others for this important step. So, after you have the book half done (more or less), perhaps you could repost and ask for some help in the proofing process.

But again, even without assistance, forge ahead. If God is in this, it can be done -- even by one.

[BaptizedBeliever]

I have no problem updating the "-eth" words to "-s" or "-es" words. I just point out that "spelling has been updated."

[bornfreedom]

Whatever you do, do not get rid of the Latin in the footnotes. Believe it or not, but the Latin is important to the understanding of the Author's thought process even though most do not understand Latin. Also, its important to note that the author used Latin as part of his exegesis (the method of interpreting Scripture), and so its integral to the text of the book. Moreover, the Author used Latin for emphasis in the text, and by removing the Latin, you remove the emphasis of what he said. So, please - leave - the Latin in.

Blessings,

Thanks brother, I will try and preserve what I can, most of it is not legible. Brother Gurnall does however only use the Latin in order to quote his sources and not to expound his text or make his points.

[bornfreedom]

Technically, that is not "Old English"....it's barely "Middle English" and the style of the Jacobean/Caroline era is really the beginning of "Modern English" (as is the King James text)

Banner of Truth did an abridgment in "modern English" a few years ago. Personally, I'm skeptical of both abridgements and language "improvements" In the Bible world, that's the justification for 900 variations of the English version though, in fact, it's just a money pit for publishers.

Gurnall's work is readable and understandable to any educated English reader who will put forth the slightest effort. I'm afraid to look, but I guess there are "modern English" versions of Shakespeare out there too! good grief!

Point well taken, I too am somewhat skeptical at times concerning so many Bible translations. However most Bible translations (Modern) are not abridgments. The objective is not to make the text simpler or more relevant to our modern English. The objective is typically to translate from manuscripts that The King James authors ignored. I simply want to make this precious gem easier to read for those that perhaps are not well educated or weaker in English than others and to do so in a way that makes it available free of charge and of course on e-Sword. I don't presume to know the motives of those who have abridged this work in the past. Only God knows the hearts, I fully respect Banner of Truth's efforts to abridge this work and am grateful for the fact that they did. World Challenge also did an abridgment in which the proceeds go to their wonderful missions work all across the globe. GB

[Ed Franklin]

[1.]... The objective is not to make the text simpler or more relevant to our modern English.
[2.]The objective is typically to translate from manuscripts that The King James authors ignored.

re 1: In some cases.....in other cases, that's precisely the motivation.
re 2: In few cases...there are some literal translations which include sources not used by the 17th century scholars. Whether those are an "improvement" is hotly debated.

Out of my (rhetorical) 900 versions, perhaps a dozen have linguistic, scholarly value. The rest are $$$ for publishers. "Relevancy" is king in this century, so we have Bibles for every social class and cultural aberration. I'm expecting the Gay Bible any day now.

Now, I will admit to a mistake in challenging both revised language and abridgement in the same breath. It is possible to have one without the other. An abridged "Bible" does exist and is utter foolishness, in my opinion. But the abridgement of a literary work can be justified. Purist that I am, I'd say it's audacious to take a masterpiece and undertake to select just the "good parts" for publication. Like taking a Van Gogh and keeping just the "pretty parts" of the painting.

DISCLAIMER: All the foregoing is just the rambling of an old coot with too much time on his hands and should be easily ignored ...no lasting injury should result from reading this.

[LarryG]

Three Dollars Worth of God
I would like to buy $3 worth of God, please.
Not enough to explode my soul or disturb my sleep,
but just enough to equal a cup of warm milk
or a snooze in the sunshine.
I don’t want enough of God to make me love a black man
or pick beets with a migrant.
I want ecstasy, not transformation.
I want warmth of the womb, not a new birth.
I want a pound of the Eternal in a paper sack.
I would like to buy $3 worth of God, please.

— Wilbur Rees

This work by William Gurnall is just a little more than some bargin for, thank goodness. I hope you enjoy compiling this masterpiece.

Edited by LarryG, 08 May 2012 - 03:53 PM.

[billhuff2002]

I have a formatted E-sword version of the "The Christian in Complete Armour" by William Gurnall. I need to tool-tip it and it will be ready to post. I will move this to the top of my list and try to have it complete in the next 48 hours or so.