19 replies to this topic

[Josh Bond]

Don't panic. I'm not asking for volunteers to implement tagging (this will be a long term process). I already have one dedicated person (Bill Huffman) plus myself and anyone else who wants to join in. We have the implementation covered. This post ismore about you giving advice on the content of tags.

What is tagging on other Bible sites?
Let's look at David Cox's site. When he makes a post (equivalent to an upload on BibleSupport.com), he tags his upload one of 2 ways.

One way is "by topic" (see screenshow below of topics). I envision a hierarchy of tags (like this) on left-side of the screen in the Downloads area above or below we currently have "e-Sword Categories". (I need help with what the tags should be--one thing missing from this list is denominations).
 tagging1.png   19.13K   3 downloads

Another way David Cox tags: He tags resources with keywords that don't appear in the list above. I do not have a complete list of his keywords (I have asked him for a list if he can produce one). Some of his keyword tags look like this:
 tagging2.png   39.03K   2 downloads


Tagging at Bible Support
IPBoard (our software) has the basics already done. I will have to code the display of tags on the front Downloads page (easy to do). IPBoard leaves it up to the administrator on placement of these things.

Tags will appear in 3 places (or wherever we want them to).

1) I want to show a list of tags prominently on the left side of the Downloads Page near "e-Sword Categories". I'm likely to shorten the space "e-Sword Categories" uses. I intend to put all the "lesser used" categories like Study Notes, Memory Lists, etc under a "More Categories" link to free up vertical space. The placement of a tag hierarchy would look something like this:
 tagging-4.png   57.62K   1 downloads


2) Right now (already done) when a file is tagged, you can see similar files by clicking on the tag.
 tagging-6.png   17.45K   2 downloads


3) Right now (already done), when a user or moderator uploads/edits a file, they can choose which tag to apply:
 tagging-5.png   22.74K   3 downloads

Notice the "test" tags. That's why I'm making this post. What should our tag hierarchy look like? I think David's is a good start (first green graphic above). Maybe add denominations.

Feel free to post here, or message me privately about this with your ideas and suggestions, both on the content of the tags and my proposals above for showing tags on our site.

Attached Files

•  tagging-3.png   30.96K   1 downloads

Edited by Josh Bond, 08 December 2011 - 11:58 AM.

[DoctorDaveT]

This will be great when fully implemented! Ideally, you'd like tags to loosely follow the Dewey Decimal system (my preference) or the Library of Congress system. Generally, here are some essentials:

1) Tag for each book of the Bible and Tags for each broad category of Scripture (Pentateuch, Pauline Epistles, OT, etc.)
2) Tag for each broad theological category (Bibliology, Soteriology, etc.) as well as general Systematic Theology. I would recommend adding "Dispensationalism", "Apologetics" & "Comparative Religion" to this.
3) Tag for denominations and broad theological disciplines (Baptist, Charismatic, etc.) {Interesting concept to consider: Depending on your theology, where do you put "Mormon" works? "Comparative Relgion"? or "Cult"? or as a denominational choice? or as the "GOP's Only Hope" tag (just kidding about that last one)}
4) Tags related to History modules, like "Biography", "American History", "Egyptian History", etc.
5) Tags related to Practical Theology, like "Pastoral", "Missions", "Prayer", "Sermons", "Homiletics", "Devotional" (but that may confuse some with the .devx type of module...), etc.

That list should provide 100+ tags to start with. A significant number of your resources should be able to be mostly tagged with that. I'm guessing that as you and Bill work through the list, other needful tags will become clear.

[Josh Bond]

I forgot to say: IPBoard supports 2 types of tagging. An OPEN system and a CLOSED system. The Closed system is what you see above. The user must select from a list of predefined tags.

An OPEN system lets the user type-in whatever they want. The upside is this is more flexible. The downside is it's too flexible--by spelling or spacing a tag differently, we would have two (or more tags) that should be one tag.

I thought about making it a Closed system at first to help us implement tagging on existing resources (make sure we use the same tags). And then later opening up the tag system and the moderators would have to follow up on new uploads to make sure the upload uses existing tags (and doesn't create new ones when a new one isn't necessary). I'm not sure ... just wanted to let yall know the OPEN/CLOSED system.

[BaptizedBeliever]

Josh...did you really mean to say this?

demoniations (bolded by me).

Of course, I Corinthians 1 condemns division, so perhaps you did mean this.

Brad

[Josh Bond]

Josh...did you really mean to say this?

demoniations (bolded by me).

Of course, I Corinthians 1 condemns division, so perhaps you did mean this.

Brad

Haha, oops that was a Freudian slip I guess. We'll have the usual cast of characters who try to jack this thread to debate cults and unorthodox tags, without me encouraging anyone (and then I'll get the emails from the other usual cast of characters telling me the "devil has infiltrated the forums" and "the dark spirit of disagreement roams your forums", haha--see, I have a sense of humor). I'll fix that typo now.

[dyan]

This is fantastic. It will make it so much easier to find the modules your looking for.
To help you make an informed decision on the way to go, here is an article on the pros and cons of tagging. See this article http://sociallibrari.../su11/node/3047


On another note,
One suggestion I have, which would go a long way in catagorizing one's personal collection of topic modules, is if it was possible to add the same tags to the file name of each topic file. This would make all topic files ready to filter in the Reference Library.

For example, lets take the topic file: Josephus, Flavius - Antiquities of the Jews.topx, and suppose the tags for this file are Jewish, History.
Then after the Tags are added would become: Josephus, Flavius - Antiquities of the Jews [Jewish][History].topx
Now all one would need to do is input [History] in the Reference Library Filter, to get all Topx files on History.
One Caveat: Refx files don't like name changes.

Dyan

Edited by dyan, 08 December 2011 - 12:59 PM.

[Josh Bond]

One suggestion I have, which would go a long way in catagorizing one's personal collection of topic modules, is if it was possible to add the same tags to the file name of each topic file. This would make all topic files ready to filter in the Reference Library.

For example, lets take the topic file: Josephus, Flavius - Antiquities of the Jews.topx, and suppose the tags for this file are Jewish, History.
Then after the Tags are added would become: Josephus, Flavius - Antiquities of the Jews [Jewish][History].topx
Now all one would need to do is input [History] in the Reference Library Filter, to get all Topx files on History.
One Caveat: Refx files don't like name changes.

Dyan

This would best be done within e-Sword. You could edit the resource to say: [TAGS: Jewish, History] at the top or bottom of a chapter. Then when you searched across all Reference Library material, it would appear in the usual e-Sword search. That would be another project and would probably best be implemented in new resources as module creators make them since it's extremely doubtful anyone will read all resources and tag them.

Thanks for the article, by the way. I'll read that.

[dyan]

This would best be done within e-Sword. You could edit the resource to say: [TAGS: Jewish, History] at the top or bottom of a chapter. Then when you searched across all Reference Library material, it would appear in the usual e-Sword search. That would be another project and would probably best be implemented in new resources as module creators make them since it's extremely doubtful anyone will read all resources and tag them.

Josh,
I was talking about using the Filter in the Ref Lib, not about having tags inside the module, and doing an extended search.

All I'm saying is, although this can be done manually by each user, if it could be done on-site in an easy way, that would be best. I didn't mean to burden you with more work, it must be hard enough as it, and I'm very grateful for all that you have already done. Thanks

[Josh Bond]

Josh,
I was talking about using the Filter in the Ref Lib, not about having tags inside the module, and doing an extended search.

All I'm saying is, although this can be done manually by each user, if it could be done on-site in an easy way, that would be best. I didn't mean to burden you with more work, it must be hard enough as it, and I'm very grateful for all that you have already done. Thanks

No worries, suggestions are always welcome. Having the tags inside the module is the route others (David Cox) has taken. I agree with that approach, since having [ ] in filenames invites too many technical issues.

[DSaw]

I forgot to say: IPBoard supports 2 types of tagging. An OPEN system and a CLOSED system. The Closed system is what you see above. The user must select from a list of predefined tags.

An OPEN system lets the user type-in whatever they want. The upside is this is more flexible. The downside is it's too flexible--by spelling or spacing a tag differently, we would have two (or more tags) that should be one tag.

I thought about making it a Closed system at first to help us implement tagging on existing resources (make sure we use the same tags). And then later opening up the tag system and the moderators would have to follow up on new uploads to make sure the upload uses existing tags (and doesn't create new ones when a new one isn't necessary). I'm not sure ... just wanted to let yall know the OPEN/CLOSED system.

I think a closed system would work best permanently with the ability to add a tag upon request a moderator or admin only could add the tag

Edited by DSaw, 08 December 2011 - 02:57 PM.